Shall we try the Viridian fundraiser?

[Rezwan]

Should the Focus Fusion Society use the Viridian Green Energy program as a fundraiser? We were pitched by a Viridian rep, and it sounds like a useful program. It will cost us $300 to sign up, and we need to sign up 15 new users within the first month to break even/get that back (the “fast start bonus”). Thereafter, the fundraising begins. Additional users will each bring $2/meter/mo to the organization, and a usage bonus, and some other random bonuses.

Basic Idea:
By following a link on our site to the appropriate page (yet to be set up), our members sign up to switch their energy supplier from what they have now to Viridian. This program is available in the Eastern US – NJ, NY, CN, IL, MA, PA, MD and more – once we set up the web page you’ll be able to see if your area has it.

Benefits: Our members will save money on energy (Viridian promises lower rates) and we, as a nonprofit organization,will receive a return for each person that signs up with Viridian.

The message this sends: The Focus Fusion Society is committed to clean energy now – we’re not using fusion as an excuse to ignore environmental problems. Green energy today, and tomorrow.

How it works:

Under New Jersey’s [and other states] energy deregulation law, the supply portion of your electric or natural gas bill is separated from the delivery portion. With the supply portion open to competition, customers can shop around for the best price on their energy supplies. Their electric and natural gas distribution utilities will still deliver those supplies through their wires and pipes – and respond to emergencies, should they arise – regardless of where those supplies are purchased. Purchasing your energy supplies from a company other than your electric or gas utility is purely an economic decision; it has no impact on the reliability or safety of your service.

In other words, your local utility allows people to take advantage of “Energy Choice” by switching to 3rd party providers to save money – while the utility still delivers the energy and does the billing.

Viridian is an energy supplier with a 20% and 100% renewable energy option. They have the mission of promoting renewable energy by pricing it low – they want to create demand and drive investment in renewables [this is where I have some questions – renewable energy is more expensive to produce – so just how are they cutting the costs? Is it like Walmart where they are simply taking a loss to drive everyone else out of business, or do other energy suppliers just have that much of a markup that this is not a big deal? I’d like to see some info on this.]

In any case, Viridian promises that the electric supply portion of your bill will be lower. [With the note of warning that if you had set up your bill to be averaged out over the year – this will change if you switch. You’ll be paying the month to month floating rates, so keep that in mind].

They also assure us there is no cost to switch, no credit check required (except for commercial users of over 5000 kWh/month), no cancellation fees, no deposits, no social security number. You just go to the website, and state your preference. Your bill will still come from the utility so nothing will change – except your rates will be allegedly be lower.

So, it’s a risk free change (unless your current energy supplier has some kind of evil contract with you and THEY charge a cancellation fee).
Your physical service remains the same.
You will still receive the same utility bill.
Your utility is still responsible for reliability and emergency repairs.
There is no interruption of service.

If your rates go up, or you don’t like Viridian, you just switch back for free.

That all sounds like a good deal for the customer/Member who signs up. As for our using it as a fundraiser, the appeal is that we are saving our members $, and we’re getting some money, and other than setting up the web page through their site and informing our members of the option, we don’t have to do anything. We just sit back and wait for the switches. Our check comes to us as a donation from Viridian. Not a huge source of income, but it could be a steady thing.

Of course, even that to me is a bit of a hurdle. It’s hard enough asking for direct donations, but it seems like a worse imposition to ask people to make a decision to switch their energy supply. That might require thinking, and a bit of research. It seems legit, and it’s supposed to save y’all money, and make us some…but still, an effort is required. So I’m putting it up here for discussion. If we get over 20 people who think this is a cool and simple thing of value and who say they would switch, then we’ll try it out.

On the other hand, if everyone is like me and overthinks things, then we’ll give it a miss.

[DerekShannon]

I think this would be a good idea, and I think it would also be a way to expose people who are looking for greener/cheaper energy to the idea of fusion in the near future.

At the same time, it is valid to note that NJ’s electricity is already 50% nuclear, which is at least carbon-free. So will the new mix reflect 50% nuclear plus 20% renewable for 70% carbon-free? Or could you end up with 20% renewables, with lower costs overall because the remaining 80% comes from the cheapest coal-fired sources?

Note that your costs should be a bit higher if you purchased 100% renewable. This is because Viridian (and you through them) is buying a Renewable Energy Certificate on top of the base electricity price–That’s what makes it officially “renewable.”

[Brian H]

Nuke should count as a renewable, IMO.

Anyhow, it feels a bit like V. is leveraging some source of government subsidies for renewables somewhere in their accounting; as you say, renewables are expensive to use.

As for FF (is this re the FFS, or for LPP itself?) it seems almost like a no-brainer. I don’t see any particular downside, unless you can’t get to the 1st 15 users. If that’s a possibility, then there’s not much prospect anyway!

My other question is does the FFS have the reach to make enough people aware of this. Sounds like some of Aero’s tricks of the trade might be useful here.

[msmith]

I don’t know what their deal is but
as you say, renewable energy costs more so it is dishonest on it’s face to offer
newnewable energy for less.

What do they get out of this relationship?
FFS promoting their product/accounting trickery.

Meantime FFS has an asociation with this entity.
FFS should make every effort to avoid relationships with questionable
outfits. This one, I would avoid.

[Brian H]

msmith;
Kind of over the top interpretation, I think. In any case, they could be checked with BBB or other sources. It’s a form of direct marketing.

Their sources of energy are the wholesale market; they bid on supply from various options, and I guess that could vary month-to-month. Small retailers can do well at that game, because surplus supply from various sellers can often be had at very good prices on the spot market.

I gather it will go into natural gas next year, too. That should be interesting, as wholesale NG prices are way down, around $2.25, when less than 2 yrs ago they were up around $7.

BTW, I’m not in any of its actual or potential market areas, so I can’t offer to join.

[JShell]

I would do this, if they offered it in NY (its not there yet). this could be a cool way for FFS to invest in getting some publicity and support.

does that mean that FFS would get $24 a year from having my meter signed up? thats more than FFS dues!

i’m assuming this is legit, btw . . .

[JShell]

Viridian offers 10.9 cents a KWH in NJ . . . my current rate for renewables in NY is 12.3 cents per KWH . . . which is a little more than the ~7 or 8 cents a KWH for nonrenewable energy.

[JShell]

DerekShannon wrote: Viridian (and you through them) is buying a Renewable Energy Certificate on top of the base electricity price–That’s what makes it officially “renewable.”

RECs probably work fine, although its a little tough to tell that the credits are definitely having an impact . . . “additionality” is the issue i believe.

still, i’d do it.

[Aeronaut]

I agree with Rezwan and MSmith that this too good to be true really does get the low price legitimately. And sustainably. My guess is that they’re tapping at least one tax credit and shopping extra-difficult markets to predict the supply from. Although Michigan isn’t included yet, we get our share of offers to change suppliers. I don’t like gambling with the availability of any of my utilities. How long has this company been in business? How is it structured and capitalized? What are the odds that it’ll still be around 2 years from now?

Publicity can work for or against us, but it works big-time to make or break organizations’ reputations.

[Ivy Matt]

I don’t live in Viridian’s present market, but I do live in a state with deregulated electricity, so it could become part of Viridian’s market in the near future. I also tend to overthink things, but that doesn’t necessarily mean I’d end up against it. However, I do have the same concerns as the other Matt, and one more, which I haven’t seen openly stated so far: Does anyone else think this company’s business model might be some sort of pyramid scheme?

[Aeronaut]

I doubt it’s a pyramid scheme, just an attempt to beat the commodities market on energy supplies. While it can be done for a year or few, sooner or later the company loses a big bet and you end up shopping for the newest version of Viridian. Hence my questions relating to proven stability.

[Dr_Barnowl]

Speaking from the UK, we’ve had a deregulated gas + electricity market for some time now. I’m currently with a supplier (Ecotricity) who project the unique selling point of investing all their profits in new wind farms, and they also do a mixed brown + green or pure green option. Here they promise to match the “brown” price of our top 6 electricity companies, so it’s not entirely infeasible that Viridian could offer a discount – especially in a market that is new to deregulation and hasn’t settled on a market price as opposed to a monopoly price.

I’m a little sad for you though – you’ll start to be bombarded by all the deeply annoying cold calls from people trying to get you to switch your energy supplies to their company, since all it takes to be an energy supplier now is an office, and because all it costs to move is administrative costs.

They’re also now selling bonds… I may actually buy a few. 7.5% is not to be sneezed at in the current economic climate.

[Aeronaut]

Dr_Barnowl wrote:

I’m a little sad for you though – you’ll start to be bombarded by all the deeply annoying cold calls from people trying to get you to switch your energy supplies to their company, since all it takes to be an energy supplier now is an office, and because all it costs to move is administrative costs.

They’re also now selling bonds… I may actually buy a few. 7.5% is not to be sneezed at in the current economic climate.

Not having Viridian in my state doesn’t mean we don’t have Viridian’s competitors in energy, auto insurance, phone, mobile phone, and TV, lol. The energy speculator business model is not proven to have any staying power, and the billing doesn’t clearly separate the supply from the delivery sides in my market. The entire issue is confusing to the average consumer. So the real bet in that industry is the same as investing in any registered security: can said speculator see the future of natural gas and or electricity prices clearly enough, for long enough, to consistently deliver on the too good to be true claims? My bet is against.

I like playing with cold callers. My counter script goes something like this:

“What are you selling?”
“I’m not selling anything”
“So this is a social call from a stranger?”
[Floundering noises]
“How did you get my number?”
[Something vague]
“So you didn’t check the no-call list?”

In my experience, very few cold callers are professionals. The vast majority can be a lot of fun if you approach it right.

[vansig]

i have no choice for energy supplier right now

[Aeronaut]

Do we really want to endorse Viridian or any conventional power provider? I don’t think it’s a good move.

[Author]

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